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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I would like to hear from some Glock 27 Gen 4 owners that have a perfectly functioning handgun where the recoil spring is NOT in any way damaging or gouging the inside of the polymer frame.

I own one that is really making a real mess out of the inside of my pistol after a very few rounds, and there are Glock owners and representatives who tell me that this is NORMAL!

So, to capsulize, I would like to hear from some people who don't have the gouging problem from their recoil spring!

Here is the link to my Damage Photos after 50 rounds:

Glock27-05.jpg Glock27-02a.jpg
 

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Hey what's going on.

That kind of wear is definitely not normal, although it may not be damaging to your pistols performance (don't take my word on that-get it checked out), it is imperative for you stop shooting it immediately to prevent further damage to your frame.

First off. What, if any, upgrades or modifications are made to the gun? Aftermarket barrel? Aftermarket recoil spring? Ect...

What I would do is clean the inside of the frame where the damages are so there is no loose debris. And without taking offense, make sure your RSA is installed correctly. In the picture the recoil spring is seated on the upper notch of the barrel, I'm assuming because this is what happens after manually racking the slide a few times (which is normal in most cases for the spring to pop up a bit). Make sure the spring is seated in the bottom notch of the barrel and give it a good push with your thumb to make sure it is fully seated and centered (not hanging to the left or right).

Also make sure you are disassembling the gun correctly, as doing it incorrectly could have created that wear. Mag out, depressed trigger, ect...

No disrespect, I am sure you know to do disassemble and reassemble your own gun correctly these are all just troubleshooting steps to help you out, which is why you came here.

Keep us updated!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
GeeTwoThree,

Here's my REAL problem!

I just purchased a new Glock G27 (Gen4) on Sunday, October 7th. (My first Glock ever) Even when cycling the action by hand and disassembling the pistol, the spring was becoming jammed between the barrel and the frame and was almost impossible to disassemble. When I was able to disassemble the pistol, I was scratching the heck out of the interior of the frame. This problem made me positively sick on a brand new gun!

I wrote to Glock describing the problem, and they replied!

"It is normal for the recoil spring to drop out of the half circle notch. It should be placed in that notch prior to reassembly."

Hmmmm . . . doesn't seem normal to me, but then again they are the experts on Glocks!

I went out yesterday and put 50 rounds through the pistol to make sure that everything was normal when firing it. When I got home and was able to disassemble the pistol, my brand new gun didn't look pretty. The polycarbonate frame was badly scarred and I am sure that the damage and self-destruction will only continue if I keep firing the gun. I simply don't like to see a brand new gun being destroyed right before my very eyes.

I own a lot of handguns, and this NEW Glock 27 Gen 4, which is three days old, is more damaged and scratched than any other gun that I own! And, some of them are 50 years old.

I took a few pictures as best I could and will take any suggestions on how to remedy the situation!

----------------------------------

I wanted to provide this forum with an update on my progress on my problem. I shipped my Glock G27 off to the factory this afternoon via FedEx Overnight at a cost of $64.47 with Insurance. I paid $549.99 for the gun plus $32.99 Sales Tax plus $2.00 for the Background Check plus a $3.00 Gun Tax. With the return shipping, my total cost is now up to $652.45 for my first foray into the Glock Community. That’s a lot to pay for a gun that cost less than $100 to manufacturer. Yeah, I know it’s hard to believe. Everyone should start by reading the book Glock: The Rise of America’s Gun! I think that most people that are reading this forum would really enjoy it.


It's hard for me to believe that ANY manufacturer, even Glock, or their professional representative would SUGGEST that it’s NORMAL for a recoil spring to jump out it’s assigned position and gouge (metal on plastic) the polycarbonate frame of a gun every time it’s fired or cycled by hand! John Browning would be turning over in his grave to hear such a absurd story or his ghost would be wailing in extreme pain!

I absolutely love the gun and it's so manageable to shoot. I would hate to NOT be able to add this little toy to my tool belt! I'm not a steel plate guy, but find its accuracy very very good for such a short barrel. Much more fun to carry than my 1911.

I'll keep people posted of the outcome to my G27 problem.

JohnnieBush
 

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I don't (and wouldn't) own any Gen 4 Glocks.

I just checked my Glock Mod. 22's frame (Gen 3 or 2). I bought it new around 1993. It has 2,150 rounds through it. There isn't a mark on the frame anywhere. On my Glock, the area in your photo looks like NOTHING has ever touched it. That is the case with all six of my Glocks & I have more than 16,000 rounds through them. I purchased three of them when I was working in retail firearms & my ammo was half price. None of them have ever malfunctioned.

Glock must think their customers are complete morons who can be made to believe anything - including "It's normal for a gun to self-destruct as you shoot it," and "Malfunctions are caused by your ammo."

On the other hand, we can't expect Glock to be honest & say, "We wanted to save money by outsourcing frames & parts to cheaper manufacturers."
 

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The half circle notch is the assembly position. It is not the operational position. If you field strip 100 Glocks, 1 or 2 may be in that notch (if that many).

Edit to add: if you need to ship any handgun in the future, pay your local dealer to ship it, they can ship it for much cheaper than you can.
 

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Nothing against Gen 4 Glocks. I own one which functions perfectly fine. To the OP, I would bring it to a local Gunsmith and get a professionals opinion, and/or contact Glock right away and have them check it out. I think its safe to say that that kind of damage is not normal.

Good luck!
 

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Let's be clear on something. There are two different issues at play and a possible issue of confusion. There IS a well known Gen 4 issue where there are small bits of the polymer that chip off of the inside on a Gen 4 frame. This is normal and does not affect the firearm negatively in anyway. With that said, without seeing the actual damage itself, someone only hearing about it may think that the two issues are related and claim it's a normal issue.

What I see in the OPs picture does not look right and does indeed lend one to believe "something" is not right. While I have the luxury of living within an hour or so of their US facility, even when having to ship a firearm back to GLOCK, I don't think you'll find anyone that will say that GLOCK won't take care of you.

Having deep gouges cut out of the frame is a real concern. Having a small piece of black polymer chip away on the inside of the gun is an entirely different story. For those that want their firearms to be show pieces, you've bought into the wrong gun. Go spend a few grand on a 1911.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
More Info on My Compound Spring

I don't (and wouldn't) own any Gen 4 Glocks.

Glock must think their customers are complete morons who can be made to believe anything - including "It's normal for a gun to self-destruct as you shoot it," and "Malfunctions are caused by your ammo."

On the other hand, we can't expect Glock to be honest & say, "We wanted to save money by outsourcing frames & parts to cheaper manufacturers."
First of all, I was really careful with regard to spring placement before firing the pistol. Before shooting the pistol, I hand cycled the action several times and in the photos attached, you can see that the recoil spring has jumped entirely out of the normal seated position and is barely hanging on the barrel lug itself.

After I noticed this happening, I carefully inspected the compound spring and noticed that the washer on the end of the spring that would seat against the barrel lug had slightly rolled edges. This was an indication to me that the end retaining washer on the spring was a STAMPED part and was not a machined part like I see on many of the replacement springs that are for sale on the web. I'm not making any judgement at this time of the personal merits of the washer, but merely laying another piece of the puzzle on the table for consideration.

After observing this rolled edge and before ever shooting the pistol, I tried actually rotating the spring through it's horizontal axis to find the area of the washer, that under a magnifying glass, providing me with the GREATEST bearing surface area. When I was able to identify this area, I marked the washer on the spring so as to be always be able to reposition it in the horizontal axis with the most contact (Surface Bearing Area) against the C cut in the barrel retaining lug.

I then hand cycled the gun several times trying to obtain the best possible position for the spring with the rolled edge retaining washer. I also noticed that the spring washer was NOT resting entirely parallel to, or in 100% contact with to the broached C shaped cut out the retaining lug. I did notice that the spring was less likely to jump completely out of it normal position when located in it's best location! But, it ALWAYS moved up significantly out of the C area on the barrel lug after hand cycling the action a half dozen times quickly.

After hand cycling the action numerous time while rotating the recoil spring to different positions, I observed that my BEST location was my marked area of maximum bearing and that this area provided me with the best spring retention! This geometry was significantly better that the results that I had when rotating the spring 180 degrees and hand cycling the action.

I can assure you the spring was carefully seated in its proper position before ever firing the pistol a single time!

JohnnieBush
 

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Good troubleshooting, although with a Glock these sort of steps should not be necessary out of the box.

Is the RSA still scraping at the frame, creating new marks?
 

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I have no idea, - my new G27 is in back in Gaston's hands at this time. In fact, this is actually Day 16 for the little baby at the Glock hospital! I don't know how long they'll have to keep it.
Ah man. That's bad news but I'm sure she'll be alright! She's in my prayers haha
 

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The half circle notch is the assembly position. It is not the operational position. If you field strip 100 Glocks, 1 or 2 may be in that notch (if that many).

Edit to add: if you need to ship any handgun in the future, pay your local dealer to ship it, they can ship it for much cheaper than you can.
Not always. During Glock's frame fiasco, my dealer wanted $75.00 each to ship my two frames to Glock.
 

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I have no idea, - my new G27 is in back in Gaston's hands at this time. In fact, this is actually Day 16 for the little baby at the Glock hospital! I don't know how long they'll have to keep it.
So you had already shipped it back to Glock before your first post...

Glock will treat you well... They aren't always fast, but they are thorough... They will do a good job...
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
"Glock Will Treat You Well"

Bean's.jpg
Glock will treat you well...
Maybe I'll put that little quote on my Tombstone someday! "Glock will Treat you Well". I was trying to think of other companies that I have similar respect for and found the list remarkably lacking. The only outstanding one that came immediately to mind is L.L. Bean. I'll give you an example. They used to offer to re-sole their Maine Hunting boots for some nominal cost. Well, my brother called them and to arrange to send a pair of LL Bean boots back to Freeport, Maine. He told them how much he liked the boots and that he'd gotten a good 15 years of hunting out of them.

When the boots were returned postage paid, there was No Charge! There was a short note from Bean's stating that they had examined the boots, re-soled them and felt they should have lasted a little longer.

In the "Olden Days", I once had dinner with Leon Gormen, the founder of LL Bean's and I was impressed with the man. I hope that Gaston lives up to his billing!
 

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Johnnie, I think you made the best decision sending it back to Glock. They will definitely remedy the situation well, and will get you set to go. That wear is definitely not normal, and honestly, I bet you get a whole new frame and RSA out of it, if not the barrel and slide too. Let us know when you hear back from them.
 

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What's the latest on this matter?
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Epilogue - A Happy Ending

I want to update everyone reading this forum on the outcome to my problem with my G27 Gen 4 Glock. After shipping the pistol off to Glock, which I wasn't really authorized to do, - I had simply informed them that they were getting the pistol back and I asked them to evaluate the problem that I was having!

I shipped it FedEx overnight and had record of the receipt of the pistol at the Glock factory. Quite a while went by and on Day 29 I received a call from Lee at the Glock factory to discuss the problem. I asked him replace the damaged frame with a new frame, which I didn't feel could be repaired to like new condition. With a little reluctance, I was told that he had to talk with his supervisor. The new frame was APPROVED!

I then discussed my cost of sending my new G27 back for repair. He told me that Glock would NOT pay for any of shipping costs to return my new pistol to the factory. But, he did offer to replace my sights with the Glock Night Sights to at least partially compensate me. So, that's the story and we parted as friends, - no complaints about Lee.

Yesterday was my Glock's Day 36 away from home, - a FedEx Truck arrived with the little box to sign for. What a happy looking little gun. I instantly took it apart to examine the new frame and viewed what looked like the brand new pistol that I had purchased the first week in October. Their packing list was straight forward, - INSPECTED, REPLACED FRAME, MEETS FACTORY SPECS, TESTED OK.

Now to the fun part! Lock myself in a dark room and look at the new Night Sights! (Better than telling time with a new Rolex) They look really nice to me!
Now to the real fun, - add some bullets and start shooting! I shot a box of 158 Gr. Federal Copper Jacket Solids without any malfunction in any way. Then I tried 25 of my own reloads, knowing full well that reloading is NOT APPROVED by Glock. I had spent an inordinate amount of time making sure that my 135 Grain JHP Nosler looked like factory ammo. I even went so far as taking each individual cartridge and dropping it in the chamber of my removed barrel. After hearing the happy little thunk of the each cartridge bottoming out and then effortless falling out of what appears as a slightly over-sized chamber, I loaded of up the clips and started firing. Again, no surprises of any sort. The gun fired flawlessly every time and is deadly (scarey) accurate at 25 yards!

I had noticed, upon inspecting the pistol, that there was little or no lubricant showing on the factory returned pistol. Yes, I know that this is NORMAL. On page 26 of my Glock manual, under the section on Cleaning the Field Stripped Pistol, there is a note under the SLIDE stating that the copper colored lubricant found on portions of the slide of a brand new GLOCK pistol should not be removed, as it will help in the long-term lubrication of the slide. Well, I didn't find any of this copper based colloidal lubricate on my slide, so I added an extremely light coating of Nuclear Never Seize 2000, which is an anti-galling copper based lubricant to the slide rail. Now the gun looks like a brand NEW gun from the factory again!

Glock get's Four and a Half Stars out of a possible Five Stars, - which is an outstanding GRADE! Had I received a cash reimbursement for my return shipping cost of the new gun, I would have chosen to award them the full 5th STAR.

Regardless, I am 100% satisfied with the gun at this time.
JohnnieBush
 

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Did Lee by any chance tell you what the problem was that caused the damage to the frame?:confused:
 
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